Marketing or Manipulation? What Scamanda Teaches Us About Influence

that is essentially what you’re trying to do with marketing is getting people to act in a way that they may not have acted otherwise because of what she had built up and how effective her campaign was acting on emotion There’s so many different things that we do that we purchase because it made us feel a certain way And she was making people purchase because she was making them feel a certain way You have to understand the psychology of people how they think how they react to things their responses what stimulates that motivation to do something or purchase something I think if you have that then it doesn’t matter what you’re marketing Do you understand people’s actions like what motivates them what’s the universal message here that will get that kind of response from people you have to be so perceptive who your audience is but then also how they

think [Music] Okay So today we are mob bosswives We are We’re dressing for the part we want Why is it harder to sit wow Yeah you’re having troubles over there It’s a lot It’s a lot happening

You look fabulous Thank you so much So do you Every time I sit in this chair it feels different I don’t know why It adjusts to your aura I’m like I’ll start getting used to I’ll just start getting used to it No So today we’re doing overalls Matching twins overalls If you’re new here um we bought these overalls Not together but together right see it all started They should go back through our Tik Toks because we did a Tik Tok about it the day that you first came in with them and you were like “I forgot I had these I found them.” And I was like “You look amazing.” They’re standing pants Really right They’re not good sitting pants but sit sleigh stand sleigh you know whatever We’re going to try to go for both but it’s really a standing sleigh But um she wore them and then I don’t know if I dared you to switch outfits with me or you dared me to try I was just kind of like prove it if they look that good prove it And I was like “Okay maybe you need to see them on someone else to see how cute they are but on you.” Because I thought they would look terrible on me because I’m like 4 in taller than you And I’m like “These are never going to fit me.” Because second of all despite the height difference they’re also children’s overalls They are children’s overalls So it’s like you will appreciate how hot you look when you see how bad I look joke was on us because they looked good on both So they’ve a little bit become uh sisterhood of the traveling overalls And then she went out and got not listen the fact that they’re the same Not only exact overall exact rips in the knees chill Same size Why how are we the same size there’s like a twoft height difference between us I’ve I I am a short round girl You are the tall total curvy girl No you’re not Like I we’re the total It truly is traveling sister pants I’m just like it doesn’t make sense that we have the same jeans Anyway that’s the story of the jeans And um so sometimes we coordinate and make sure we wear them on the same day In fact I think my words to you this morning were like “Do you feel skinny enough to wear them today?” because they’re really like you have to be just in the right part of the month to feel skinny enough to wear them So it was like I I squeezed them on today And then we both got new fur New fur If you’re still here listening not not over this conversation Why aren’t you watching on YouTube why aren’t you if you’re listening at all you’re missing a whole layer Yes So I got uh got new fur and now she’s in like Immine white It’s her mine Yeah it’s just like this gorgeous white which is crazy I cannot be trusted with white And it’s like I look like a Oh wow I can’t say what I was just going to say Ah what is the words I want you look like you belong um in the with the family from Frozen that has the sauna I haven’t seen Frozen so I don’t know Would they have a big winter blowout during the winter i have like caveman fur pelt kind of color I can’t think of words I can’t think of the words I want of of the type of Probably not a good visual I’m giving people who aren’t just get on YouTube if you’re not if you are not watching us on YouTube yet Don’t imagine me in a caveman belt Nobody needs that visual in their brain Visual So just go to YouTube and see what is actually happening It’ll make your day much better Yeah I feel like this is a really good example of how we’re wearing the same thing and yet still very two very different personalities So and I wore my sharpest nails for this Kind of lowkey terrifying They really are good for stabbing Yeah that’s all I think I put my contacts in and out of my eyeballs with these things No you you can’t possibly How is that possible dangerous It’s like half inch and they are actually like to a point They’re not like I know square nails or even oval That is like I know I need to do some damage kind of walk home alone at night kind of nails I should have wor I should have I should have worn them on my trip because I couldn’t take my mace with me But these are real weapons So how those shouldn’t be anywhere near I didn’t even file them down They were so sharp I was like “Oh I’m not filing these at all.” See I would like take an eye out if I tried to do anything like that I were I actually put them on initially for the Kentucky Derby So because I love that you do that too I should put up a picture of me at the Kentucky Derby You guys do it You do it every year I love that It’s a good excuse to I always forget when it’s happening Ridiculously Used to photograph horse shows Like I should be all over that Next year Okay Okay So next year you need to come and next year you need to dress just as ridiculously as I did this year Need an excuse Oh and that reminds me I We’re going to move on to real marketing things in a second guys I promise Um uh what are those things called what is it called i Okay so fascinators I’m bringing them back I’m bringing back in style I should have worn mine today but I need to find one in Texas and we’re going to wear when I come back the next podcast we do after I’m back Okay Fascinator I’m going to find something obnoxious because there’s something about having a fascinator on that’s just like I’m the actual queen of England here I love it So I’m bringing them back I’m going to get lots of head turns like I don’t get enough already Will you be able to handle the onslaught of attention i love it I told you when I was in True when I was in uh France just like my gosh everyone taking my picture So I’m used to it People do it a lot But anyway yeah So we’re all we’re all uh decked out today just for you guys Just for you guys I’m like I can’t I I made these last all week just so we could do this I’m do I’m working on brakes tomorrow I’m I’m putting brakes on my friend’s car tomorrow So I’m like these are coming off I’m going I’m going into mechanic mode And these have If I can actually I should see how long I can keep them on while I do brakes White nails while you’re doing car mechanics Like Yeah that’s going to be gross I could take a picture Maybe I could put that in here You should Anyway so what are we talking about today we’re talking about scamming Specifically we’re bringing in a little bit of our our true crime Like enough time has passed that I can tell you of my crimes No but we we love like in the office several of us love true crime And so we’re talking about Scamanda Scamanda Amanda Riley Yes Yes So I watched it and then you watched it We were like “Well so this has to be actually was it Christina?” Christina was telling me about it and I was like “I don’t know this story.” And I’m so glad I didn’t watch it when it came out because it was while my mom was going through her cancer Was it that long ago the surgery Yeah She was going through her whole Yeah Because it was before right before the pandemic The documentary was Yeah there was what there was a documentary done a few years ago and then there was a more recent documentary that was done So when it first aired that was like right in the middle of my mom’s cancer journey And if I had seen it then I probably would have driven to her house and Yeah done bad things Yeah Yeah Yeah Because it made me so enraged when I just saw the details and learn the details and stuff So but yeah it interesting story Most people have probably probably have heard of it or knew I maybe was the last person to not know about her Um but there are so many it’s amazing that she could pull off what she did And so we’re kind of dissecting it from a marketing standpoint like why did her marketing of herself which is essentially what she did so if you don’t know work so well Yeah If you don’t know anything about the story she pretended that she had cancer She milked money off of like tons of people Um mega church She had fundraisers at with with local restaurants Yep So she just made a lot of money over lying about having cancer Yeah So she sold her story Yeah Sold it well And so we’re like marketing marketing angle on that She did some really smart thing terrible person horrible human being but she did some really smart things Scamming works like if you do it right I not that mark marketing isn’t scamming It can be but as a container role it’s not but it is manipulative because on some level um some go hard on that direction but all marketing is manipulation if you really stop and think about it because you are trying to tap into people’s emotions and um help them to realize that they need something that you have Yeah Um so there is a little bit of manipulation there but um she took it to like next level Like the way she didn’t she did it wasn’t ethically right No But there were several things that she did that you could glean from it that were like okay this is a good concept but don’t do it the way she did it Right So starting this all out by being like we think she sucks and is a bad person evil person But how what are the marketing parallels here right Yeah Right What were the things that she did right that made this so successful for her yeah Because they got it was over $100,000 in donations I think total Was that it Thought it was more than that or 105 I I think it was a number like that Okay Um but I thought it was interesting because um they said in the documentary that it all started with an off-hand comment like one of her neighbors or one of her best friends had said something about how they found out a family that they knew um the mom had cancer And so they immediately went into like what can we do how can we help how can we you know writing checks and and that like planted a seed in her brain like she can make money It was like the next day or the a few days later she called that friend who relayed that story to her and was like I have stage four cancer It’s lymphoma It’s bad Number one I would have been like this sounds familiar Like I don’t understand how people were just like oh my god really i especially like knowing what kind of per you had did you have no gut instinct about what kind of human this was i know some people don’t some people don’t have that intuition You have to be a bad person to do this Yeah Like if you ever called me and said you had cancer I would never doubt it See that’s the thing Most people wouldn’t So like one of the things that she did she banked on people’s goodwill But I do know people that if they called me and told me they had cancer I might be like “Do you simply because of who they are?” So that’s like lesson number one Know your audience She knew that this friend would believe her okay she knew her audience Like this was a good friend of hers her She heard this had this conversation with this friend and knew she was the heart on the sleeve like someone is in need I’m going to help them I will empty my pockets and help them if I can Kind of She must have had money too She Yes Yes Her friend was wealthy and they um had been friends for a while like this wasn’t just she wasn’t newly friends with this person and then suddenly trying to pray on her kindness It was there was a developed relationship here She knew this person and that does make it even more legitimate So she knew her audience She knew how to cater to She knew the words to say and she knew who to go to Yeah Who to go to Yeah Cuz she didn’t go tell every all of her friends She told this one friend and then word got out and then it was like people had a cause Yep H So yeah I guess that’s a good point Like I don’t know I like I joke I would not believe certain people but I do think I would probably believe like 99.9% of people who would come to me with that Right It would take a really scandalous person in my life who I’m like you’re kind of known for being a liar to be like no you don’t Do you really like but if someone I felt like I knew pretty well and didn’t have a history of lying to me right i’d probably be like I’d have no reason to question that right and especially if I was a wealthy person and was a giving person like why wouldn’t I right yeah And she knew that Yeah And you think about too like she was very strategic in what she chose to use as her hook M cancer Yeah Who hasn’t been affected by that right and when they were interviewing several of the people that were in like her community and in her friend circle you know part of her support group several of them had either had cancer herself her stepdaughter oh yeah had cancer Went through a terrible fight with cancer I mean that’s part of the rageinducing thing for me Like so her stepdaughter was like in her corner immediately because like if you’ve gone through what someone else Yeah is saying they’re now entering that same journey You’re like oh let me be your guide Let me help you through this I’ve been there I’ve been in those trenches Like I will help you however I can I’m here for you she tapped into that like and I think that was also very smart of her when she figured out what that hook was going to be like what’s going to be my how am I going to get this off the ground how am I going to get that money coming in it’s like you use that big emotion because if she said some random right disease people it’s not as triggering because it’s kind of like is that deadly like is that a big What are the statistics here but everybody universally knows like cancer that you hear for you hear just that word quickly It immediately puts into your brain like death bad like like death sentence like it’s just and so no you don’t even literally within a second it puts all of that into as soon as you hear that word But another disease might not do that It makes you go what is that is that bad you instantly hear Sarah McLaclin playing in the background like I’m going to give everything even if I don’t have anything Yeah And I think so that was super effective too She knew who to talk to and she knew what to make the core of her message was this is a cancer fight and she had two small kids Oh it’s so sick You know I’m I’m a young mother The nerve like I can’t I can’t get past the nerve of it I think there was some like deep narcissism involved like because she still was like scamming people in prison That was the last I heard Oh really yeah She was still like asking to be taken to the ER like every other day Certain kind of per because I’m just like there’s something broken in my life when whenever I’ve told like the smallest lie I’m sick over it for weeks So I can’t imagine I can’t imagine telling one that hurtful that damaging on such a large scale and being like “And I’d do it again.” Right Cuz she Yeah And it it’s just interesting the steps like it was like there were so many layers to this and that’s what also made it believable too Like it was a well orchestrated campaign Basically she used so many different channels to get her message out there and to create um emotion and to create community Um and she like really she really built that up so that it seemed like you couldn’t question it like what else could be happening and in hindsight in hindsight that probably could have been a red flag because I’m like people who are going through stage four cancer just as a as a person who has watched someone die of stage four cancer uh you don’t have a lot of energy Certainly not to be campaigning Campaigning to be alive is all you’ve got So the campaign of like all these different platforms where she’s just like happily typing away about like her day-to-day life when you’re on stage four you’re you don’t have that in you But people and this is where the marketing tricks like it was just enough to get people to take action without really stopping and picking it apart Yeah And I think um because she did enough of the right things to get people to do what she wanted them to do Um so like she she told she told the right people she had the right core message to get people to act but then she did all the other things like um she became part of several community groups um became part of the local mega church So she like expanded her audience in simple steps like it didn’t she she chose like ways to increase her audience that weren’t a lot of effort Yeah So which is also a brilliant marketing strategy Yeah You you go for what’s going to give you the biggest bang for your buck And that’s basically what she did Like how do I increase my audience without much from me like it’s not going to take a lot out of me to do that right so she did that She also started a blog online after telling everybody and she called it my journey my blog my journey or something like that And um so she posted a lot with regular posts So people came to like kept coming back Yeah They wanted to keep up with the story and there again you know another brilliant marketing tactic You keep up with the information Uh you keep It’s like added value You’re giving them more information And um people became drawn into her story It became part of their daily life to check in Yeah Every week or every day I can’t remember the frequency that she was posting Um and she used a lot of imaging Yeah Um triggering imaging Yes like her with and that still blows my mind like how she did that I mean she was all the medical equipment She was going into hospital environments and doctor’s offices She’s like making use of her time her studio time there Seriously you you’re you’re stuck waiting for the doctor to come in for how long usually you know when you’re on these appointments So bold So she’s just like find going through drawers and like finding things and like taping things to her face to make it look like she’s there getting treatment And I’m just like it’s diabolical It is I can’t even begin to imagine being like that But so she was really smart about using imagery to keep that connection Yeah And images do a lot Like we’re such visual people I mean why do those Sarah McGlaughlin puppy commercials work you see these like quivering dogs and you’re just like take my money And it’s the same thing She’s like “Look at me mom of two small kids in my stage four cancer journey H we’re back for another another round of chemo.” And you’re just like “Oh this poor woman She’s just going through it.” So she used not just writing but also imaging you know visuals to really create that narrative that created an online community And um and then having the church community that also supported her like her network was huge She ended up building this huge following doing just really simple things but they were effective Yeah And that’s such a good strategy too Like it doesn’t always have to I mean this definitely was a big production but when you boil it down to what she did Yeah they’re simple steps Right Right So um yeah it’s not that complicated when you break it down No no And so you don’t have to have like she had good execution her level psycho but it does show too commitment right commitment But um I think uh another thing that she did was she built a website on her own too I forgot about that Yeah And opened it up for donations And so money was like pouring in that way So website construction like she’s ticking all the boxes with this campaign She’s just like doing it all making sure this website was like I think they used um they did these promotional videos too that they were putting on the website and online um like on their social platforms of her like just footage of her family and her with the kids at the beach to like fight song that was like the track over all this video Yeah And so it was like her Sarah McGlaughlin moment you know people were just like equating that imagery and that song like it became it is motivational to take out your credit card Yeah Right Right They were like look at this And so there was all this you know promotional stuff that happened and then they had because of all that and because of the community creative created by that and the narrative that she was promoting that they were just eating up and believing Um her supporters would then turn around and actively promote her So she got word of mouth which is like such a huge thing for businesses really is you know and that is almost I think the most brilliant part of her strategy because that is the one of the most if not the most effective way I really feel like it’s a business can grow because when you hear it directly from someone who’s your friend someone you respect someone that like in her case people who had had cancer Yes were promoting her right so I mean how how much better you can’t put a price tag on that kind of advertising or that kind of marketing Yeah So um the word of mouth getting people to promote her on their own social media channels was just a brilliant brilliant move It sounds like just in general her living in so many different places gave her so much opportunity to make money So she’s got her her website donation and she was you know I think if she had the GoFundMe or what all the other ways that she had she got a friend to start someone who had had cancer started that Yep And then she was taking um there was I in my memory there’s one instance at the church where they had never done this before where she gave this motivational speech and then everyone came up and threw money on the stage So it was like she was like all thousands of dollars They ended up all which again genius cuz I’m like you look like such a jerk if you’re not one of the people walking up throwing money at her But so it was so so many different opportunities to draw in new people and new money So if you don’t want to donate this way you’ll donate this way And if you’re at the church you’ll give that way And if you stumble upon my website you’ll donate that way So she she really she plastered herself kind of everywhere Broad portfolio Yep Yeah and she got it worked in a lot of different ways Yeah And that the thing about the church that I thought was really interesting because that is essentially what you’re trying to do with marketing is getting people to act in a way that they may not have acted otherwise otherwise And that’s exactly what she did This church had never done anything like that prior to and I don’t think they have since Um I hope not because they were scammed But but she because of what she had built up and how effective her campaign was she got them to do something they’d never done before Yep So it’s like masterclass moment Acting on emotion Yes Played on emotions She was so tapped into people’s emotions because of what her core message was what she had just dedicated her campaign to It was a cause that everybody could get behind And you think about how you shop for instance It’s so often based on emotion Yeah It’s um I’m I’m starving right now and so I’m going to buy this I have had a bad day and so I’m going to go get myself a coffee It’s I haven’t had a shirt that makes me feel this confident in a long time so I’m buying it There’s so many different things that we do that we purchase because it made us feel a certain way And she was making people purchase because she was making them feel a certain way right and we may not have something like cancer to market Correct You know but the thing that we it it doesn’t really matter I mean granted that was I mean top tier thing Yeah She went for the top She went all the way to the sun So we’re we’re not always handed something like that that you know that’s going to just be emotionally effective but you can still be just as effective because it was the mindset there that you have to understand what how the nature of people You have to understand the psychology of people how they think how they react to things their responses what stimulates that motivation to do something or purchase something And so I think if you have that then it doesn’t matter what you’re marketing If it’s insurance if it’s um something in banking if it’s something in real estate it it doesn’t really matter It’s do you understand people’s actions like what motivates them And you have to understand what’s the universal message here that will get that kind of response from people What’s the angle that we need to come at this from like you can do it with it It doesn’t matter what you’re what you’re working with But that’s just how humans are going to behave Right Right She just happened to tap into a super strong emotion Um but you can do that with no matter what your product is And I think that’s the that’s the interesting part to me as a marketer That’s the part that I love the most is sitting with something and you’re like “Okay how are we going to move this?” Like what what is it going to be what’s the magic thing how is someone gonna feel when they read this or see this right you have to be so perceptive And I I think to be good at it you have to be p you have to have good perception of your audience Have a clear clear mind set on who your audience is but then also how they think Yeah What’s going to make them follow through to the call to action right why would they do that is always the is always how you operate Why would they right And it is it is manipulation I don’t know if you have to be good at manipulation too to be a good good marketer What do you think i think it’s less manipulation and more of like like you were you were heading on the road of talking about like um like being perceiving what people feel and what they need It’s more of like getting it’s I don’t feel like it’s even manipulation It’s more of like sensing what people need sensing what they want sensing what they feel Yeah Yeah And then just using that which I guess is manipulation Yeah That’s why I feel like it there’s almost this line that you’re walking as a marketer Some some cross it but it it can feel a little icky if you’re doing it wrong I guess I guess it just I guess it depends on you know is it because I’m trying to am I looking at this photo or this photo that I think that they would like on Instagram or is it because I’m trying to get them to donate for cancer i I don’t feel so much like the the toxic manipulation of like which one’s going to make them like this picture more which one’s going to get them to to you know unethically give me money I feel like there are differences there in the spectrum of like Yeah And I but I’m thinking about like different campaigns that you work on depending on the client too And that’s where I

think you know you decide what kind of clients you work with Yes Most of the time Yes So if there are some that are uneth unethical that are definitely just doing a money grab Yes You choose whether or not you work on something like that So you live with yourself You know that’s a great point if you want that to me can be more manipulative where it’s like we’re not providing something that people need that we’re just educating them or that we don’t back Right And that’s where I think there’s a difference between manipulative marketing and marketing itself I feel like there is a difference there I know I’m trying I’m kind of getting off topic a little bit It’s more of like a scam marketing versus there is Right And this is where like she was definitely a scam She was definitely scamming people because she wasn’t really sick So she’s not But I feel like with some marketing campaigns like sometimes you’re promoting a product that’s super beneficial to people Right Right And that those campaigns I love because then you’re thinking about the audience and you’re thinking about how do I help them to understand that this is a good thing for them and we’ll help them and we’ll help them genuinely right um and that’s the majority of what we who we work with like that’s just because our company is genuine like we’re not in marketing to be manipulative per se So any type of

like I don’t know if you call it low-level manipulation because marketing is on some level manipulation but it’s it’s more of an educational like I need to convince them I need to help them see that they need this Yeah That this will make their life better But when it’s just flatout manipulation like she did it’s just icky It’s like a Yeah But she did it brilliantly And there are there are companies that are brilliant at separating people from their money Like that is Yeah I think there’s a difference between marketing something that is you know works is quality you know you can back and then things that are just like feels like a bit like a bait and switch you know the Yeah something that you purchase for instance and then you get in the mail and you’re like this is just crap Which is basically what she did Yes or this is fake or not not what was advertised right whatever So I feel I just feel like there’s a difference and I feel like the it it just raises that good point in question like can you do you believe in all of the clients that you are marketing for mhm When you promote their message is it one you believe in when you are helping this company uh to you know sell things on the internet do you think that it’s it’s worth it the things that you know what I’m saying ethics comes into it like your company’s ethics definitely come into it because that will um influence your whole trajectory as an agency and like where where are you going to go where do you draw the line y um because she had superpowers when it comes comes to marketing Yeah She knew exactly what to do She wasn’t a marketer Like that’s that wasn’t even her job Yeah But she was so um just innately talented when it came to it Like all a lot of aspects You can’t you can try to teach people I mean you can try to go to college and learn it but she was already like masterclass when it came to what she did I think because like you said I think she probably was narcissistic and so she was the had the number one good trait of being able to read people Yes And what to get them to do for her Yeah We don’t you don’t have to be a narcissist to be a to be able to read people but it you do have a superpower Correct Correct You know it’s it’s like people with It’s heightened It’s very very heightened Yes Yes It’s like people with autism who know everything about dinosaurs or are brilliant with math you know it’s like you just have this innate ability to be genius level at it And that’s what she was And so I mean she knew her audience She knew how to talk to them She knew exactly what to make her core message about to gain the most

um emotional um reaction Reaction Yeah She knew exactly what to tap into um and surrounded herself with support by building you know this whole community online And you know that’s what businesses are you know they try to do You build a website you want to attract people and then you want them to stay there right so it’s the blogs it’s the visuals it’s the do you have forms to fill out like she had GoFundMe link you know she had all the things that generate interest and generate that buzz around her campaign and and then having these videos with you know fight song and you know it these gimmicky things that just if your emotions started flagging like she would time it Well here’s something else to just pull you back in You think so that hits on one of the points that I found that she maintained the blog which is called lymphoma can suck it filled it with updates like you said photos and fabricated um the medical progress but the this mimics a long form content strategy designed to build trust and authority The more she posted the more real it felt to her audience the long it was like she was in it for the long game She was in it for the long so this wasn’t just like this was like a a you know term campaign to just like raise a little bit of money like a GoFundMe generally is this was like she knew she could keep this because especially just the title of it lymphoma can suck it like has this like feeling of like she would always have it Right Right It does kind of make you feel like this isn’t going to take me down this is going to be a longhaul journey and I’ll just fight this forever and you can keep donating forever Yeah So I thought that that was kind of interesting Yeah Yeah Yeah I love it Uh another one was about uh crisis management Um when in inconsistencies arose she doubled down and more blog posts and explanations trying to control the narrative This reflects damage control strategies where brands attempt to maintain their image under scrutiny though in her case falsely and manipulatively I thought that was interesting Anytime that the issues uh arose she was just like doubling down like doubling down You would think like when she went swimming at her friend’s pool and this is when people started to doubt her because she had said um she had just gotten treatment that day or something She had had fluid Oh she told them she had fluid drained off her brain Her friend was watching her kids and the kids were at her house swimming in the pool because that morning she had to go to the hospital to get fluid drained off her brain And then she gets to her friend’s house to you know pick up the kids and she jumps in the pool and swims underwater and her friend was watching her and was like “Um you don’t do that if someone just tapped into your brain I don’t feel like I need to know anything about anything to know that that sounds like a bad idea.” Right Right Like and that you wouldn’t want to Exactly You just had like access someone had access to your brain still have an open wound I’m going to go jump in that chlorinated pool underwater Underwater with the pressure and every change Um yeah No no one would do that And her friend just watched her and was like “Oh oh something’s up.” And that’s when it started to unravel And her friend started like calling people and was like “I think we’re being scammed.” And that was when she started doubling down instead of like being smart like “Well the cancer got better actually.” No she was just like “Some people,” she like referenced it in her blog like people that I thought had my back don’t and they might be spreading you know she looked for sympathy and was just like “Nope they’re liars.” Yep And just the audacity Like I’m almost I almost have admiration for it because it’s so it’s so sick It’s so nice The fact that she got away with it for so long is like It it makes me feel bad for everyone that was fell victim to it like because you know you you really only are going to give to that cause either number one out of obligation which I’m sure some people felt they were under obligation or number two out of because your sincere you know feelings for someone going either for her or for cancer right probably more cancer many of those people didn’t know her personally especially so many people in that group had had it themselves right and as a person who has just recently lost someone to cancer it just makes me sick I’m just like to to know what someone actually goes through when they are suffering She’s claiming stage four and I know what stage 4 looks like It is it is just you are not you’re barely human at stage 4 and it’s just for her to make a mockery of it It’s just so and make money on it when I’m still getting calls every day about my dad’s uh medical bills I am uh it just makes me sick It makes me sick Yeah So marketing genius Marketing genius Use it carefully I listened to the Free Dive podcast and became a scammer They told me exactly how to do it Told me whose documentary to watch so that I could learn If you make money off of this podcast please share some I guess No but it’s just I think I thought it was just such an interesting I mean after I got over my actual like anger anger and disgust over it Um it’s fascinating to look at it from a marketing standpoint because it was such a good campaign and it it shows that you don’t have to start it it doesn’t have to be some big production It could be like simple steps that you follow really well Yeah And like she executed it was execution I think more than the big idea Yeah For her Yeah And I think that was such a good lesson too Like it’s not always having this genius idea Sometimes it can be something very simple but the effectiveness comes from how it’s executed Because that part was next level She didn’t have to make anything up You know what I mean it it but it was so effective because every single point she executed well from how she blogged from the website and how she set that up how she built her audience and grew it and um creating a narrative and like she just did all the pieces Genius level like just until she got caught Right Until it came apart And even when it came apart just her doggedness to be like “It is not going off the rails.” No I know Did she ever admit to it she did finally in court Yeah That she was lying about having cancer Yeah But then in prison like it popped up again that she claimed to have something else several times Like there was so many I I can’t remember the exact number but it was something like 30 documented hospital visits or something within a short amount of time Like it was still like “Oh I’m dying Oh guys I’m dying.” Like she could not stop herself Like she needed the attention or the I don’t know what but good try babe Yeah Oh my god Yeah Wow But having some of those characteristics though I mean are something that a good marketer is striving for So use with caution Yeah I mean it I felt like that documentary was worth watching Just Yeah That way too Unless you’re going through cancer right now or someone you love is going through cancer you just lost somebody like maybe don’t watch it right now because it will enrage you Did you ever end up watching Apple Cider Vinegar no I haven’t had time to because I’ve been working so much Yeah I know Well that’s your next one That one is fictional Well okay It’s it’s a fictional like docu series but it’s based on a true story mostly I don’t know if I explained that well but anyway that story of that girl is also very very it’s very similar and um it’s gotten me interested in the real girls story cuz she very similar faked pretended to have a cancer and got a group of like she made a ton of money off of it and got a group of like real cancer survivors or people together and how angry they all got And anyway yeah I don’t know if I’m ready for another one like Yeah Yeah I’m kind of glad I’ve had so much work to do I haven’t been able to watch it It’s entertaining Anyway it’s But yeah it makes me now want to look you know I wonder if anyone has watched what other scam documentary like what other scams have happened that actually have like a touch of brilliance to them that you’re there’s some lessons we could learn here I know I can’t think of any other evil but scammer documentaries I know Now I want to like deep dive that I have to be careful like looking for documentaries because some of them are just like I thought this would be okay and it is not and you shut it off Shut it off The R I I do not believe in the rating system I don’t think it works I really don’t I feel like sometimes things are like way like dramatized and other things I’m just like I’ll never be old enough for this I’ll never be So I try to do my research but yikes Yeah But anyway well well this is fun talking about I don’t know how many insights we gave You know it’s if you’re a marketer you understand marketing or maybe you just like talking about scammanda I don’t know Maybe I don’t know But I just think it’s interesting how where we can find we both came away from that and we’re like there’s some lessons there There’s some marketing like unexpected places Well I mean we could start a whole offshoot of this podcast of unexpected marketing lessons you know and just finding them in the most unexpected places This was one of them What have you guys got leave it in the comments Or your favorite documentaries They don’t scam ones but they don’t even have to be scam ones I want to hear all your favorite I need a new one I need a new one I know I have no show right now Oh that’s not a lie I’m watching the Natalya Barnett one again right now That one the one about the little girl who was adopted and the parents said that she was actually Oh that she’s actually like an adult Yes I don’t know too much about that one either I feel like I’m on the fringes I used to be like solid That one is a little triggering too cuz like child abuse comes into it Oh yeah See I can’t do anything But I’m manic right now So I’m just like whatever Pile it on Pile it on Anyway I don’t recommend that promised myself I was not going to forget to find out a question to ask you and then I forgot Oh no I was so looking forward to that Well Christina’s on vacation and the last few episodes we haven’t done it but I promise the like guessing the Can you think of one off the top of your head i was like maybe I can think of one above like what do I know about everybody in the office i kind of do know everything about everyone but I’m I was just I can’t I’m just like it’s not It is We’re recording this on a Friday Like I know this is weird for us Like we’re just there’s like no one in the whole building It’s weird So we’re just like we’re tired and getting this together But yeah Anyway Okay When I come back from Texas the next time that we podcast is Christina back have a good question for me Next week This is none of your business I don’t remember But anyway I I don’t know I am like I’m lost without her So like I need I need her to bring me back to center Things will start getting better Okay Okay I will bring back I will bring you all back more guess the team member questions next podcast I promise Okay So I hold you to that Yeah And you come you come back and record with me next time too Yes Hopefully with an obnoxious Texas fascinator Okay We’re promising That’s my goal I don’t know how much I mean this is like a very there and back kind of trip situation We’re not Amazoning Amazon

ambiguity Amazon’s going to be the new one Great We’re expanding that We will be here with fascinators Fascinating with fascinators New podcast name Poor language skills still but fascinators Yeah sounds good Okay we will see you all next time Bye It’s the end No it’s not There’s more There’s always more Don’t be sad You can catch our full video interviews on our YouTube channel Come find us and don’t forget to subscribe like and share with your friends so that we’re not sad And follow us on Tik Tok and Instagram It’ll make your day happier Promise and we’ll know if you do it Until next time